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	<title>Comments on: Thinking about zero</title>
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	<description>A progressive take on BC issues (formerly The Lead Up)</description>
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		<title>By: Milena</title>
		<link>http://www.policynote.ca/thinking-about-zero/#comment-552</link>
		<dc:creator>Milena</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Jan 2010 01:58:32 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Marc, thanks for the reply - and I hear you...I guess I do hope for a more socialist variety of &quot;capitalism&quot; in the future, and especially with regards to huge, huge systematic issues such as 

1) sustainability
2) poverty or alternatively - quality of life
3) urban infrastructure such as roads, parks, etc.

I simply don&#039;t believe a purely capitalist model will EVER solve these issues in an even remotely equitable and fair way to all its citizens...

Socialist-inspired programs or hybrid models have worked in Europe now for decades...why can&#039;t we? I&#039;m serious, I hope capitalism isn&#039;t going to be forever &quot;here to stay&quot;...

...not that we disagree really I don&#039;t think...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Marc, thanks for the reply &#8211; and I hear you&#8230;I guess I do hope for a more socialist variety of &#8220;capitalism&#8221; in the future, and especially with regards to huge, huge systematic issues such as </p>
<p>1) sustainability<br />
2) poverty or alternatively &#8211; quality of life<br />
3) urban infrastructure such as roads, parks, etc.</p>
<p>I simply don&#8217;t believe a purely capitalist model will EVER solve these issues in an even remotely equitable and fair way to all its citizens&#8230;</p>
<p>Socialist-inspired programs or hybrid models have worked in Europe now for decades&#8230;why can&#8217;t we? I&#8217;m serious, I hope capitalism isn&#8217;t going to be forever &#8220;here to stay&#8221;&#8230;</p>
<p>&#8230;not that we disagree really I don&#8217;t think&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Marc Lee</title>
		<link>http://www.policynote.ca/thinking-about-zero/#comment-551</link>
		<dc:creator>Marc Lee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jan 2010 22:16:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.policynote.ca/?p=2286#comment-551</guid>
		<description>Milena, great comment. 

There is definitely something to the potential that climate action will increase prices for food, electricity, transportation, etc. This is the legacy of cheap fossil fuels that have underpinned our lifestyles, and thus the challenge of eliminating them.

And this will have a bigger impact (aka &quot;regressive&quot;) on low income families, who have benefitted the least from cheap fossil fuels. The best option is to tackle poverty head on, and ensure living wages and decent social assistance rates, for example. In the absence of that we are always going to need &quot;second-best&quot; solutions that build in provisions for low-income families to address such impacts.

There are also many alternatives that address climate and put the burden of adjustment where it should be -- on the most affluent, who are emitting the most GHGs in the first place. A carbon quota, for example, would do this. 

Real change is also structural, not individual. It&#039;s not about everyone being persuaded to buy an electric car but to ensure that communities are more walkable, and public transit options cheaper and easier. Those actions level the playing field for low-income families.

So it is less about e-cars and energy-efficient mansions as it is about neighbourhoods with greater density, closer proximity to parks, services and shops, and that are inclusive by having dedicated affordable housing.

It is also about creating and expanding the public realm as it relates to basic needs: food, water, electricity, etc. Capitalism is not going away any time soon but we can start to push it further out of core areas of the economy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Milena, great comment. </p>
<p>There is definitely something to the potential that climate action will increase prices for food, electricity, transportation, etc. This is the legacy of cheap fossil fuels that have underpinned our lifestyles, and thus the challenge of eliminating them.</p>
<p>And this will have a bigger impact (aka &#8220;regressive&#8221;) on low income families, who have benefitted the least from cheap fossil fuels. The best option is to tackle poverty head on, and ensure living wages and decent social assistance rates, for example. In the absence of that we are always going to need &#8220;second-best&#8221; solutions that build in provisions for low-income families to address such impacts.</p>
<p>There are also many alternatives that address climate and put the burden of adjustment where it should be &#8212; on the most affluent, who are emitting the most GHGs in the first place. A carbon quota, for example, would do this. </p>
<p>Real change is also structural, not individual. It&#8217;s not about everyone being persuaded to buy an electric car but to ensure that communities are more walkable, and public transit options cheaper and easier. Those actions level the playing field for low-income families.</p>
<p>So it is less about e-cars and energy-efficient mansions as it is about neighbourhoods with greater density, closer proximity to parks, services and shops, and that are inclusive by having dedicated affordable housing.</p>
<p>It is also about creating and expanding the public realm as it relates to basic needs: food, water, electricity, etc. Capitalism is not going away any time soon but we can start to push it further out of core areas of the economy.</p>
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		<title>By: Milena</title>
		<link>http://www.policynote.ca/thinking-about-zero/#comment-550</link>
		<dc:creator>Milena</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jan 2010 19:34:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.policynote.ca/?p=2286#comment-550</guid>
		<description>This is more of a rant than I comment I suspect...but as it happens I had a long angry thought process about sustainability last night which was not terribly optimistic. And here is why. 

Yes sustainability means you and me and Jo Shmoe making more &quot;green&quot; choices in our lives, and yes North America is hugely responsible for greenhouse emissions and energy consumption. ... BUT... the bottom line is, it isn&#039;t you or I or mr. Schmoe who is going to make or not make a big dent in energy conservation and sustainability. Hence, Copenhagen. 

My problem isn&#039;t Copenhagen, it&#039;s capitalism. It is ironic but once again green technology, green cars and self-sustaining buildings, organic food, etc. is associated with $$$ value and only accessible to the socially-conscious upper middle class. Two years ago I was part of a project building a solar house and marketing it to young professional couples (Solar Decathlon, put on by the US Dept of Energy). That&#039;s exactly my frustration - instead of a wide governmental program to transition all housing to sustainable energy housing and green living, ideally self-sustaining, all of these things are developed and marketed by the private sector for huge $$$$ unattainable prices. Same with cars. It&#039;s easy to say, we should all drive green cars. But the people who drive some of the oldest cars which are the biggest polluters do so just because they can&#039;t afford to get a new green car. What about socio-economic sustainability on a personal scale?

I am part of another sustainability project now, trying to look at multiple perspectives and meanings of &quot;sustainability&quot; and one thing that was said, which I like is that sustainability isn&#039;t an end goal, rather sustainability thinking has to become part of the bottom line. That said, I feel much empathy for the regular person who may just not be in the economic position to radically change their life. And why should they when our government doesn&#039;t even make huge companies change their ways. Until we have a more socialist, country-wide, heavily subsidized plan for change for everyone (not just yaletown yuppies who will be able to afford a solar home in a few years when that is a reality) no significant dent of any kind will be made in any of my definitions of &quot;sustainability&quot;.

peace n vinegar

Milenaa</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is more of a rant than I comment I suspect&#8230;but as it happens I had a long angry thought process about sustainability last night which was not terribly optimistic. And here is why. </p>
<p>Yes sustainability means you and me and Jo Shmoe making more &#8220;green&#8221; choices in our lives, and yes North America is hugely responsible for greenhouse emissions and energy consumption. &#8230; BUT&#8230; the bottom line is, it isn&#8217;t you or I or mr. Schmoe who is going to make or not make a big dent in energy conservation and sustainability. Hence, Copenhagen. </p>
<p>My problem isn&#8217;t Copenhagen, it&#8217;s capitalism. It is ironic but once again green technology, green cars and self-sustaining buildings, organic food, etc. is associated with $$$ value and only accessible to the socially-conscious upper middle class. Two years ago I was part of a project building a solar house and marketing it to young professional couples (Solar Decathlon, put on by the US Dept of Energy). That&#8217;s exactly my frustration &#8211; instead of a wide governmental program to transition all housing to sustainable energy housing and green living, ideally self-sustaining, all of these things are developed and marketed by the private sector for huge $$$$ unattainable prices. Same with cars. It&#8217;s easy to say, we should all drive green cars. But the people who drive some of the oldest cars which are the biggest polluters do so just because they can&#8217;t afford to get a new green car. What about socio-economic sustainability on a personal scale?</p>
<p>I am part of another sustainability project now, trying to look at multiple perspectives and meanings of &#8220;sustainability&#8221; and one thing that was said, which I like is that sustainability isn&#8217;t an end goal, rather sustainability thinking has to become part of the bottom line. That said, I feel much empathy for the regular person who may just not be in the economic position to radically change their life. And why should they when our government doesn&#8217;t even make huge companies change their ways. Until we have a more socialist, country-wide, heavily subsidized plan for change for everyone (not just yaletown yuppies who will be able to afford a solar home in a few years when that is a reality) no significant dent of any kind will be made in any of my definitions of &#8220;sustainability&#8221;.</p>
<p>peace n vinegar</p>
<p>Milenaa</p>
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